Coupe into Speedster Conversion

[roy mawbey]

Guys,

I mentioned in my last mail Steve Hogue Enterprises had some good 'you tube' videos. I give below the 1st video of the planishing hammer in action producing an early 1951 356 rear fender fabrication.

The video is shown in a number of parts 1 - 4 so when the video for this first stage ends the next three are shown in the final page showing the selection of his videos. To see this item produced using his shrinking dies on I guess his special planishing hammer machine is really artistic!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4XjAW5l8XQ

Anyone tell me please advise me how long a wrist watch lasts when you do that everyday?

Roy

[JTR70]

I am going to get very bogged down in this area before its all over Phil. Agree, I only hear good things about Steve!

Hey Mark, Good point and very true. The screws do loose their bite after a few cycles.

Thanks for posting that video Roy! I have watched those several times and it is fascinating to watch a master work. An old mechanical watch would probably not fare very well to repeated exposure to that sort of vibration. Funny you should mention going further into the chassis. I did just that yesterday and of course found more rot that I would have certainly overlook otherwise. You're right there are many cars that still have rusted out components after or before steel repair that simply cannot be detected by visual inspection. I doubt very much that your car has these time bombs lurking deep into its chassis. Surface rust yes and is to be expected but deep cancer I wouldn't think so. Thanks again you guys!
1/31/14
Prepping and planning rear seat pan and closing wall repairs.
As Roy had coincidently mentioned I too am now getting into new and unfamiliar territory with this back seat area. Until now I have never had to cut so deeply into a 356 chassis to repair it. After cutting away the right outer interior closing wall I had to spend some time to asses and plan next series of repairs in here. I have to reverse engineer and plan in my mind how all of the mount flanges are sandwiched together so I build in the right order as to not "lock myself out" once I begin mounting both the pan and new cross-member.


Began yesterday by cutting the old rotted wall out to expose the cavity. It was interesting to discover just how interwoven and integrated the seat pan is to the frame runners. As you can see the remaining portion of the pan comprises this inner "floor" and is flange welded to the interior of the outer frame runner.(hope that made sense) The flange is "nuked" on there with a double row of tightly spaced spot welds. They didn't want this coming loose!

The pan is also seam welded to the lower inner flange high lighted in green. A lot going on concerning anchor points here to say the least!

To make my life easier and to speed up this repair I thought I was just going to add a strip to the new pan and lap weld it the remains of this old section deep in this cavity to conceal it. However as you can see I really have nothing to attach and weld to. This old section too is all cancered out as well and will need to be replaced So much for a simple repair in here. I can only hope I have better luck on the left side. The outer wall is not as rusty so I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Roy, this section is a prime example of the rot you spoke of that normally will not be addressed because you just cannot see it without cutting through a wall. Continuing on... Thanks for stopping by! Justin

[JTR70]

1/31/14
New closing wall from Steve Hogue arrives today.

Rough mock-up. Lots of trimming and fitting to come but a very nice part from Steve's shop; very pleased with it.

Very tempted to begin installing it today but the repairs to the seat-pan inner frame section will be much easier with this piece out of the way.

Thanks again to Steve for knocking this out so quickly! We'll be doing a lot more business together to turn this sows ear into a speedster.
Justin

[JTR70]

1/31/14
Prep work on right side seat pan area continued.

I removed the remaining upper cap at its mount flange to give me a clear shot at this remaining section of old seat pan.

Detailed shot of how far gone this section is.

I cut this old section free at its mounting flange as well and will go back and grind the flange off. No way I was going to drill 200 spot-welds. I finally got past all the bad rust in this area. A good coat of surface rust on the rest of this frame but its all solid. It should all clean up nicely.

I'll begin paper templates tomorrow for the new filler strip. Thanks for looking! Justin

[merbesfield]

Maybe Steve H can send you some more new shinny metal and you can just scrape the rest of the project . LOL. Keep on going and soon it will resemble something.

[JTR70]

If this thing was any worse that's about what I would have had to do Mark.

2/4/14
new repair section in

paper template evolution and a solid 30 minutes spent grinding that original mount flange off.

new piece fabricated from a section of perimeter kit. They do come in handy for other repairs; like this one. The old section had 3 round embossments and even though this will never be seen again I didn't want to put it in plain so I boinked three holes in to replicate what was there.

After several test fits and tweaking it was ready to weld. For simplicity I cut this part short right at the base of that curve and will finish it up with a separate section.

I popped that relief hole in the flange for the spring plate boss so it would fit snug against the wall. The original was sort draped over it and not welded very securely as a result. See photo below:



Welded! The cavity was first coated in converter and then sealed in epoxy before this part was tacked in.

The new seat pan will butt-weld right up against this new section and will share that outer mount flange. Weld joint will be of course much stronger and concealed from the bottom.

With that in I'm clear to begin mounting this new right side from Steve. Working on that now. Thanks for looking! Justin

[JTR70]

2/6/14

Left side seat pan/frame prep.

Finally tied up that loose end in the corner there. Corner was heated and shaped flush against the new panel then plug welded. Also welding up the seam on the transmission access hole. With this panel all but welded up I moved onto the left side seat pan/frame area.

This side is rusted through but not as severe as the right and I was hoping the remains of the original seat pan was in better condition so I would not have to replace it.

Once I opened the panel however it was clear that its just as weak as the right side was. I'll have to replace this side as well. Not catching a whole lot of breaks with this thing. working on this side tomorrow. Thanks for stopping by! Justin

[Phil Planck]

Justin - as usual, great work. Isn't it a bummer to keep running into more bad metal? At least it is structural which does not require near the amount of finishing as exterior.
Phil

[Drew.s]

Hi Justin
Great, great work.
One question, the new panel from Steve has square indentations but I have seen on a few speedsters and it was the case on my Con D that had one square and one circular indentation either side.
is this a late car thing or an open car thing?




Regards
Drew

[JTR70]

Thanks Phil, Very true it requires far less fine finishing compared to the skins. This was disappointing to find but on the bright side it is officially the last of the hidden time bombs left to be discovered on this frame.

Thank you Drew!

This embossment detail is a late to early change. though this frame is a T2 we are building it as a T1 Speedster so I'm making these changes along the way. I began a thread sometime back chronicling these evolutionary changes from 1956-59. Take a look here, it describes this wall. :http://www.abcgt.com/forum/4-356-Forum/5072-Evolution-of-the-356A-T1--T2-How-they-differ.html?limit=6&start=48 I need to update this thread sometime. Thanks again you guys! Justin

[JTR70]

2/8/14
Left seat pan/frame repair continued.

Old rusted out section now removed. Cleaning and prep up next.

I remember saying that the lower seat section was the last rust surprise on this chassis; I should have known better. Once the outer frame panel was removed it was clear that the outer frame section has rusted through behind the bump-stop assembly. Its always "one more thing"

Bump-stop assembly from the outside

The right side shows only mild signs at the bottom and is not as bad as the left.

Began fashioning the new inner section out of Perimeter kit this afternoon. Basic shape here and will continue on with this area tomorrow. Thanks for looking! Justin

[JTR70]

2/10/14
Left repair section in and fitting new left rear vertical wall.

Left repair section in and with that the left vertical wall will be next.

Lots of trimming and test fits to come.

Thanks for looking! Justin

[JTR70]

2/13/14
New rear vertical closing wall in.

Installing this left section went surprisingly smooth with only a few modifications needed.

Once this left side was in good basic position over the bulk-head opening and the outside corner the lower center was trimmed to final length.

It was then tacked, double checked then welded up. Note how nice and even both sides fit together without any trimming to the outer flange. Steve makes a nice panel.

This "loose end" corner from a few weeks ago was also finally welded up.

With both sides all welded together I began welding this flanged opening together starting from the bottom. I now understand why Steve requested a template of this particular opening so he could get the shape close. These two pieces are not very forgiving if they are not shaped closely enough. The lower right corner had to come in a bit but as I tapped it in a spot would just spring out wide ahead of it being that it reacts like a ring. So I had to cut two relief cuts in the lower right corner to get it to slip on.

The roughest fitment I ran into was at the top. The arches were contoured just a bit off. A little splicing where needed eventually gave me the right fitment.

Good contoured fit and Just about ready to begin welding it the rest of the way.

Opening finally stitched together.

With this wall now in I am onto prepping the new seat pan for installment. Thanks for looking! Justin

[tperazzo]

That chassis looks so naked. Gutsy build for sure and you are doing a great job. So much cutting necessary to make it new again. I'm enjoying all the pictures of concealed areas that I never got to see in my car. Really cool!

I don't think I have the patience to do two or more 356 projects simultaneously.

[JTR70]

Thanks a lot Tom! This all new territory for me as well since I have never had to go so deep until now. Agreed it is interesting to see the deep attachment points on these frames; like the seat pan subsection I've been working on for the past few sessions. I look at the outside of the frame rails on my coupe and now know exactly what those line of spots-welds are holding. Learning something new about the construction of these cars makes it not so mysterious now. Thanks again for the encouragement! Justin

2/17/14
New donor seat pan prep.


Began chipping off the old tarpaper insulation on both sides. What is left of the original closing wall would be removed next.

To be able to test fit the new pan the rear upright of the support-frame would need to be removed. I was a bit nervous when I cut it loose but was relieved to find that it relaxed and moved very little. tops of the torsion tube were cleaned of weld.

With upright gone and the main portion of the vertical wall cut off it was time for an initial test fit. A lot yet to do but its taking shape.

Filler strips yet to be cut and fitted.

Time to begin perfecting the fit. Grinding off the original vertical wall flange would be next.

Not fun Grinding and peeling but I wasn't about to drill out all those spot welds. Alternative way to skin this cat.

With the flange now clean a second test fit here. Its fitting nicer with each test which is always a positive thing.

Filler plate shapes are also coming into focus.

Here's a little detail trivia; the excess shoulder of the new wall will be cut even with the pan flange then seam welded along the corner however instead of being cut off its folded onto the pan and welded. You can see the remnant of the original highlighted with my poker.

You can also see this detail on my coupe just peeking out from under the frame flange. (circled in black) Will of course replicate this detail as well. Thanks for stopping by! Justin