Coupe into Speedster Conversion

[JTR70]

Hi Per,

No, I would never quit my day job! Things might seem to be moving faster only because I'm really not in the fabrication phase at this point. I'm more in the clean up phase so its all gelling a little quicker. Unfortunately once this car leaves here things will likely go very cold as I understand its going to an old school panel beater who is a bit of a recluse. So we'll all be left in suspense from the way it sounds.

7/27/17

Picking, filing and shrinking the welding joint and old accident damage on that old original section comprising the bridge patch.

Same story as with the left; spending as much time on it as I can cleaning it up so its not a nasty repair patch requiring a ton of filler.

Like the other side,gentle rollers remain but its a close enough fundamental shape that won't need a lot to take it the rest of the way.

Its monsoon season here so the humidity is a lot higher than normal and I noticed my freshly completed left fender is beginning to flash rust.


This car will be media blasted again but thought of watching all these silver panels fog over brown was too much to bear. I brillo'd the fender back clean and gave it a quick coat of primer.

At the same time it was nice to get the surface in different perspective so I could better make out the shape and its short comings.

Not perfect but a lot closer than I ever thought possible as I was initially fitting these sections to the car.

Added the door to again check for general shape and body contour across these two panels.

Body work yet to do but its down to just MM's of correction. I can live with that and able to pass this car off to the next guy with a straight face.

High lighting top profile and contour sweep with door.

Transitions off the door and over into the cowl as I hoped it eventually would. Again I can live with it.

I wasn't planning on primering but this did make for a definite and nice "period" to the end of my work on the majority of this fender. Just gotta get that damn trough area set. I'll be facing that soon enough but not yet; treating the right fender to some primer next then moving onto finishing out the skin along the tail section.
Thanks for looking!
Justin

[JTR70]

Front section in primer

Right fender scrubbed and ready for a quick sealer coat to hold down the flash rust.

sealed

About as good as the other side

though there is a spot or two I may chase down later if time permits once the rest of the body is to this stage.

Cleaning up the cowl and dash area next.

Thanks for stopping by!
Justin

[Don C]

Looks great Justin!

[roy mawbey]

Yep I agree looks really great.

Roy

[JTR70]

Thanks so much for the nice posts you guys! At this point it really is a compromise of how much time I can spend chasing a given area and what short comings I can bear leaving behind for the body shop.
Thanks once again!
Justin

7/28/17
Left side cowl contour and weld joint.

Have a definite bulge profile going on both sides of this cowl and was afraid to touch them because they are stable and not "oil canning" but with new corner sections welded up I realized they were eventually going to have to be corrected by someone to ever look right. Began heat shrinking that area first then picked and filed that weld joint

Leveling the joint was going pretty well but there where two spots (high lighted by the "X"s) I could not get a clear shot at from underneath due to the forward closing wall and the vent duct.

With a bit more effort I was eventually able to reduce the area of those low spots but could not eliminate them entirely. I found myself short on tools, time and talent. A deadly combination if you're striving for perfection which I was, but...

I did end up with a good general sweeping profile before it was all over.

Continues the profile off the hood on up to the windscreen and most importantly its stable and not oil canning.

Again it won't require a ton of filler to be perfect. A lot of lead used in and around this area on original Speedsters so I'm good with leaving well enough alone here.

Onto correcting the right side now.
Thanks for stopping by!
Justin

[JTR70]

7/29/17 part 2

Right side cowl area

Much better access underneath on this side to get at my weld joint. The trade off was the lump on the cowl side was very stubborn.

Eventually got it down close enough and prepped the rest of the dash area for a quick sealer coat.

Several rollers remain but its close enough for gov't work.

Its stable and consistent enough in shape with the left side.

Felt good to get this entire area in the done column.

The back of these fenders turned out a lot closer than I thought they were going to. Have to face that trunk lid opening pretty soon here.

Tying up all the loose ends on the back next.


Before I wrapped it up for the day I figured now was a good time to make sure my lower Windshield was still going to seat properly after all of the adjustments that were made out at the corners.

Much to my great relief it seated right down with no issues.

Several mild rollers and gaps along the way but nothing serious. Again this my raw shape fitment with no lead any other fillers.


Most OG speedsters I've seen have this dash lap joint completely smoothed over with some kind of filler.


With that in mind its pretty damn close and won't require very much to be perfect.



Anyway I can now confirm that an original factory Speedster windshield base will seat correctly on this car. Another big relief!

Thanks for stopping by!
Justin

[roy mawbey]

Justin,

For no filler in place you have done a fantastic job. You are correct my car had a lot of factory lead in all sorts of places, even a bit more lead by the time I finished!!

Roy

[JTR70]

Thanks a lot Roy! Agree, I have seen factory lead unbelievable thick in some areas but that was part of the reality of a production time I suppose. I always try to be up front with how good or bad the surface actually is. Its gonna need filler just hopefully not too much.
Thanks once again.
Justin

7/31/17
Begin finishing out the rest of the weld joints on the tail skin.

I had welded up this joint some time back. It of course suffered the worst of the heat warp up toward the lip where its least accessible from underneath.

Picked and filed most of it and that relief cut I had to add just at the lip so the contour sweep would line up and work.

I was able to peck most of it out but there were several spots that where just too deep to reach behind so I had to resort to my stud puller.

I tried to place that weld joint out in the open as far as I could for this very reason but as you can see it ended up just out from the closing wall. I can get to some of it but not a real clear shot.

I spooned it out pretty close but not a well as I would have liked and certainly not as well if I had direct access to the back. Before it was over I did notice I had more of a drastic dome shape going on toward the bottom here. I few spots of torch heat leveled that out. However I just realized I'm still not quite done as I have just noticed a shape discrepancy with the other side. I'm going to hold off for now until I get the other side all welded up then see what will be required to get them to mirror one another a bit more closely. Always something.

Finishing out the right tail skin joint next.

Thanks for looking!
Justin

[bbspdstr]

Fantastic work, Justin!

Quick Speedster and lead story: When I stripped 84255 of ALL previous paint from Porsche and the previous 3 owners, I knew it had been "soft" rolled in a competitive event when it was about 2 years old, about 1960. (No roll bar yet.)

The cowls were very good, considering. Then I noticed lead in a hole here and there around the edge verticals. Melting the lead, the holes were punched through and big enough to insert a "roll pick" and an old-school bodyman removed the damage so well there were only the holes, plugged with lead filler, as evidence.

Yes, the early Speedsters were loaded with lead, especially the front cowls. I have read that this was due to to the developmental changes made for this model. My personal experiences with such cars have not been as the first one there nor did we pay much attention to such in my own "formative years"...we just un-did or did what was necessary to get 'em done and back on the road or track.

One experience with Speedster lead was taking the last parts of value off of the Speedster I had help burying under a local super-highway fill project. The windshield posts were rusted tight, so I applied heat to those two areas. I remember an unusually copious amount of lead dribbling off those corners!

I have always saved that lead and re-melted it back into sticks I could re-apply. I thought that it must have been good lead and only appropriate it go back on a 356.

BTW, your inner bracing reminds me of that which I made to create the Cabriolet top jig that Auto International still uses to use to build a Cab top when the actual 356 is not present. I bought an A Cab from a guy who just wanted whatever he could get for it after I gave him the bad news as to how bad his floor was and how much it could cost to attend to the floor and all else that was rusted through. (Today, that would be a "restoration candidate" for sure.)

But hey, the fenders were good and I needed those to un-SCCA-flare 84255 to be Vintage legal!

The bracing first allowed me to trim all else away, saving the front and rear cowls and windshield frame. Roy Nielsen was thrilled and I think we traded some A.I. work for that.

Good quality work, Justin!
Bruce

[JTR70]

I very much appreciate you saying that Bruce, Thank you! As for that tooling I'm sure that Autos was more than pleased to receive that old top frame jig; they have made a lot of money on that through the years I'd bet. That buried "over Pass" speedster story just haunts me BTW. We need to get you in for some deep hypnosis then go treasure hunting.
Thanks once again!

Justin

8/3/17

Right rear fender corner work.

A ton of shape discrepancy across these two panels that was addressed earlier but even after all of that both panels still wanted to turn and sink in where they met.

It took some doing but I eventually got the immediate area on both sides of the joint to raise up where they needed to be.

It was very easy to get overwhelmed with all this mess so I had to take it one small area at a time to keep myself going.

Eventually got this immediate area I focused on to clean up. I can't begin to tell you what a confidence builder this was to be able to keep on slogging through.

keeping with that "belt line" of progress I turned to stitching up this lower apron joint.

After removing that strip of excess out along here so an exhaust system would clear (thanks again Jack) set both of these pieces rolling in as they met too. After welding some picking and filing was required to get this contour back as well.

Then I went onto cleaning up the rest of the lower apron as best as I could.

Eventually got that area up to a level I can leave for the body shop.

A nice low spot remains just under the mount tang but all the Original cars where left the similar with a nice swatch of lead over that area so its legal enough. only so much you can do with that thick piece of metal on the other side anyway.

Chased this lower section about as far as I can.

Moving upward on this joint was next.

Same issues with a lot painstaking metal bumping a little at a time.
More on that next.

Thanks for stopping by!
Justin

[JTR70]

8/4/17

Right rear fender joint continued.

The next section of this joint fought a lot more so several rounds of torch heat was needed to get the area to come up.

Before the day as out I had it out and smoothed to a level that I could live with.

This side profile contour carried the body line from tail to door jamb well enough.

Now closing in on the lid opening and a section I've really stressed out about since they were welded.

The panels really didn't flow together at all very well here. At the time I got so impatient with it that I thought to hell with it, I'll glue them together now and deal with fixing it afterward. This was of course was another huge mistake as badly misaligned welded panels do nothing but fight not mention this could not be in a worse place due to the limited access from behind. I'd have no choice but to cut this run open again to put it right.

After looking at a few pics of OG speedsters I realized another critical detail I was missing was that the relief bend at the crown of the quarter panel continues its line (highlighted by that marker line) onto the tail and terminates into the lid opening. Its very subtle depending on what car your looking at but its there..

Section re-cut, aligned with tapering detail.

I went a little too strong on that detail and can't get at it from behind so its just going to have to be. This junction will require some lead anyway and it won't take but a veneer to soften that line up.


Chased this entire run about as far as I can given the time restraints.

Not perfect but a great relief to have this correction completed.
I will bring up that low spot highlighted by the X once I get the joint between the tail lights stitched back up.

As with the front fenders subtle rollers remain but nothing that will require a ton of filler to take it the rest of the way in.

Solid fundamental shape is at least there.

Stitching the tail light joint next.

Thanks for looking!
Justin

[JTR70]

8/5/17

Right rear fender finishing completed.


Tail light joint restitched and dressed. Ready to begin picking and filing it, the lower apron joint and that highlighted low spot above it all.

Lower apron joint went surprisingly well.

Picking and filing this run now.

Right rear fender chased down about as far as I can.

subtle irregularities remain...

but nothing serious.

At a minimum a consistent general contoured shape is there.

A smooth transitional shape from fender to tail was my main concern.

Began prepping the entire surface for a quick sealer coat.

Interesting planishing marks from Trevor's power hammer that my block pick up.

That cowl joint is a lot rougher than I would like but time and access to the back are very limited. I may take another stab at it once I've got the left rear fender to this level. Ready for a coat of epoxy.

Thanks for looking!
Justin

[neilb]

[quote]
The next section of this joint fought a lot more so several rounds of torch heat was needed to get the area to come up.[/quote

looking good justin

not that you need advice or guidance but applying heat will make the metal want to shrink during its cooling. best to stretch it with a dolly behind and a flat hammer or flipper. preaching to the choir i know but sometimes when your up to your proverbial's in a job it's easy to over look things. having said that stretching while the metal is softer during heating is easier than working it cold, but it will still shrink during cooling.

i have to ask though now this job is coming to an end, what's next? other than finishing your own car. what will you do with your time? seems selfish just to finish your own car lol.

great work, much respect

[merbesfield]

Justin, looks great as always. Q, what tools did you use to get behind the tail light area and work it? When I repaired mine from the dreaded teardrop conversion, there was some shrinkage due to my welding. I have to get it out, but there is so little space to move around. Just wondering what tools and tricks you used. Thanks, Mark

[JTR70]

Hey Neil, Thank you so much! No, I'm always open to some guidance and or advice. I certainly don't claim to know everything about metal work in fact quite the opposite; I see what you're up to and think man I'm a hack.
I just grind through with what little tools and experience I have at the moment to some how get the job done and with a final presentation I can live with. Always looking to improve of course but some of these lessons are hard won and take a while to sink in. At least for me. As for the heating I'm doing, I guess I should have explained better, the low and flat spots I was dealing with at the tail skin joint where pretty bad.

I initially tried working it cold using a trick I learned watching my buddy Jason Bobruk by which you're using the dolly from underneath as the hammer to make the "big moves" upward for the stretch. After several swings it was raising but was still very low and getting lumpier. So out of pure necessity I thought about heating the general area BTW not the concentrated dime size cherry spots for gathering material but more of a soft general heat to the problem so it would raise like bread dough. With the area warm I can tap it a lot lighter and finesse it up with much more measured control versus brutally beating it out, not to mention it was so much easier on me. Sure it does shrink up a bit when cooling but if its still low I'll try and bring it out the rest of the way cold or repeat with heat if necessary. I use it sparingly and mostly when I feel likes its getting nowhere's fast. Now who's preaching to the choir?

As for what's next besides my own projects it is this '59 S/R coupe. My buddy has been waiting...and waiting for me to complete this coupster so I can help him out with the steel work on his car. Now that I'm so close I'm really feeling the pressure to get going on it which is motivating me to make the final push on this current project and get it off to the body shop. I've started a build thread on it: http://www.abcgt.com/forum/14-356-Restoration-Projects/38672-1959-356A-SR-coupe-project-chassis--108625.html
And will give a detailed chronicle about its progress the same way I did here.
Thanks once again Neil!


Mark, I used this dolly get down between the cross-member and the tail skin.

Its all I really had and fortunately for me it slipped in between. Sorry, I can't offer any tricks to making it easier because as you guys know very well, it never is; you just have to keep attacking it until you have what you want. One thing I will say about limited rear access like this is to always try and plan for outward heat warp so you'll have a fighting chance at a uniform finish. If you have to spoon it out and up with some sort of a lever its not going to be very pretty. That right cowl joint is the perfect example.
Thanks again you guys, it is always greatly appreciated!
Justin


8/6/17


Quick sealer coat

Adding this top coat really high lighted a few more flaws.

Again went a bit too strong on that contour line next to the lid but as you can see it does continue that line that runs the length of the fender. Didn't quite get the shoulder knocked off the tail joint.

Some light taps with my ball peen hammer softened it really quick.

The cowl joint area is a lot rough than I'd like. If I have time I'll chase it some more.

Though rough the fundamental contoured shape is there as this shadowed shot highlights so it keeps me calm.

Not perfect but well within striking distance. Time to move on.

Stitched up the entire lower apron run on my way toward the left rear quarter panel/tail skin joint. That up next.

Thanks for looking!
Justin