Coupe into Speedster Conversion

[JTR70]

5/4/16
left side of the engine compartment complete.

With the actual frame portion of the lower engine compartment done it was time to get the upper closing walls finished.

Part of it was also finish out the upper corner of the lid opening where the cowl and quarter panel meet. Finish the joint, plug-welds and trim off the flange excess.

Not 100% but the heavy lifting at least done to this small area.

Next was buttoning up that long weld joint where I had to make the height adjustment for the mating flange. That sucked...

Then it was onto finishing up the welds up to the firewall.

Middle to left side complete. Doesn't look like much but a lot attention required to finish out all the twists and turns. These are areas that are so hard to stay motivated to finish but its such a relief once its all behind you.
Thanks for looking!
Justin

[JTR70]

5/5/16
Inner left quarter/closing panel welding and details.

Moved the interior with the engine compartment on this side about wrapped up. Gas welded in the top frame mount and all along this closing channel.

Spot welded overlap run.

Seam welded the lap joint where the quarter panel begins as my friends OG Speedster showed.

Perimeter flange run spot welding complete. (this side)

Time to double check with my original parts to see if they still fit.

Top frame went back on for another test to make sure nothing moved or changed after all that welding. This areas closing panels all welded up for good.

Car looks deceptively at the same stage as a few weeks ago but with all the loose ends tied up with the cross-member, engine compartment, and now the left quarter closing metal it has changed a lot in my eyes. A lot of tedious detail shit now in the done column.

As you can see I'm trying to finish out small areas of the car completely so to wrap up this left inner quarter I need to fabricate and install the top frame rests/hooks. I'll see if my buddy is available tomorrow so I can profile these and get them welded on before the weekend is out.
Thanks for stopping by!
Justin

[Scott B]

Nice work as usual Justin , and great pics. That corner lid cowl must have been a little tricky to fit and even harder to grind out in a tight space and radius.
Scott

[roy mawbey]

Justin,

This latest work of yours is excellent. Until you see all that is involved, anyone thinking that chopping off the roof and adding a rear end to make a speedster has actually no idea just how complex this conversion is. Even the doors make it difficult. The tedious work as you call it would be demanding work for me. Although I have said time and time again, there is nowhere else information like you prepare is available, for those even brave enough to contemplate starting a project like this.

And all that is said, when repro body panels are possible to buy.The importance of having the chance to measure and study an original car is also so important and even that, is time consuming I would imagine.

I have a question Justin. Its quite rare you mention gas welding but you did use it above. All my 356 welding experience was with gas.Much later I tried a little Mig welding but never spot welding.

I think it would be difficult for you without Mig or Tig to achieve the excellent welding you manage?? For sure, spot welding was around for the DIY man 40 odd years ago but the refined kits of today I presume are much better for the DIY person??

For you and all those here with their threads, would you have given up by now trying to use only gas?? Gas had me actually in tears once so long ago, frustration and fear of failing. Bodywork is in a different league to mechanical fitting. I had a lifetime of close limits and could machine with confidence but bodywork is still the biggest hurdle or would be for me.

Well done !!

Roy

[JTR70]

I appreciate you saying so Scott! Definitely, there have been several tight corners, edges, etc. where I couldn't get my disc in to finish out the weld like I wanted.

Thank you very much once again Roy! Agree, there is quite a bit more to it than just removing the roof but the amount of work and time directly correlate to how detail correct you want the end result to be. I made it clear to the Doc that if he ever hoped to see a solid return on his investment then what we needed to end up with is a"Speedster" in every build detail only with a coupe chassis number. Whenever someone in the "know" looks up this cars skirt (wheel wells, etc.) I want them to believe they are looking at a '56 Speedster. Anything short of that would be a waste of time, money and a donor chassis. Once the car is built it will of course never be worth as much as an original factory speedster but its value should ride their coattails. If its finished out to high enough standard it's value should live between worlds: Less than a real speedster but worth more than if restored back to the '59 Miessen Blue coupe it started out as. But, again it just depends how much time you want to invest in getting there.

I ran across this beauty today and in my mind this is the true definition of a "coupster". Talk about a fun, no stress, no hassle build. Its a funky-sunkwagen and a quickie but one of the cleaner ones I've seen. This conversion will surely net more than a few fun open road miles but no matter how nice its painted or presented its now just a donor restoration platform in need of a roof and the final agreed upon price will definitely reflect that.
Now in this projects case the goal was to have a finished conversion that would make the prospect of returning it to coupe form make absolutely no monetary sense. I believe that's putting a donor to good use but again there are no shortcuts and the time has to be invested getting it there.

As for the seam welds in and around the top frame mount I'm using gas to replicate as closely as I can how an original Speedster looks in that area. Also, trying to improve my gas welding as their is some carry over to TIG welding. Feeding the rod into the work etc. You're right it can be frustrating to work with just like every other aspect of these old cars.
Thanks again you guys!
Justin

[JTR70]

5/9/16
Top frame resting hooks

Made it over to my buddies last Friday to have another look at his Speedster to get position measurements and a profile shape so I could get these knocked out this last weekend.

Also made sure to take a few close detailed shots like this one to keep all the details fresh in my mind.

As for material, same strap stock used for the top frame linkage. Had plenty on hand from fabricating my own several years ago.

I was a bit out of practice in timing the bends but it eventually got there.

Close enough to my crude profile shape off the original. Now it just had to be tweaked and trimmed to fit in the car properly.

Now that I had the basic part it was onto making it fit in the car.

A couple of rounds of reheating and manipulating before it fit against the closing panel and at the correct angle to cradle the top bow.

Once I had a usable profile this part was pretty rough with tool marks so I decided to keep this one as my future template. Pigtail end still needs trimming and relaxing here.

Sample part trimmed and finished. After all that it still closely contours with the my wire sample I profiled off of the original hook.

So with that test run under my belt my final two attempts went a lot smoother and quicker.

To keep both parts sized and shaped with a little consistency they were bolted and clamped together during the final bending on its mate.

Done...

Tacked into final position and double checking the a folded top frame.

Fully welded in. I noted on the OG speedster that the leading edge of the flange was fused together up to about where the quarter panel overlap ends. It was then left raw as it continued to the cowl.
Replicated most of that here.

It works.

Just a few more loose ends (as always) but just about done with all the details in this area.
Thanks for looking!
Justin

[JOP]

Justin, thx 4 sharing a untouched and molested hook......
I guess most hooks get cut off and by so is misses some of its tail part when getting welded back!

As the one in my photo.... I didnt see it before it was cut off

Gressel HB20 is a very good tool when needed to do precision part with various bends and angles.
I have one but borrowed some photos to show you how it looks like.
/JOP
Look about 2:40 min into video clip
http://youtu.be/mJDb3RxUABc

[JTR70]

That is a nice piece of equipment to have around and sure beats the hell out of making small brackets by hand. What does that unit run?

I can understand an original hook being cut short if removed from a car. The meld was so hot and thorough that you'd either have to cut the wall or cut it short as your OG hook shows. I tried to replicate that attachment detail as well.
5/9/16
Left side rear seat area completed.
Trying to simplify this overall project now by completely finishing out sections where possible.

Spent this afternoon finishing out rosette weld heads and attaching the parcel shelf in this corner. Been putting this chore off for over a year so you get and idea of how resistant I was to work on it.

By sessions end all welding and dress details finished completely in this corner; all the way up to the body skin. Felt good to just type that BTW. As you can see I didn't finish welding the right side of the shelf. That's what a PIA it is as its super thin gauge (21 or 22) and blows out very easily. I'll finish that when I do the entire right side.

Lap joints and corner details mimic the OG speedster well enough as I know they all must differ slightly.

OG speedster corner...

I still have some striker post work to do but this corner of the interior is finish otherwise.

Here's how far this corner had to come.
Thanks for looking!
Justin

[roy mawbey]

Justin,

Some nice work there.I reckon you were a blacksmith in a previous life you did well making that. Jop's info was great to watch. Very nice bit of kit indeed.

You must be correct no one car is the same as the other, photo's make you realise just how much welding took place when these cars were made.

That finished corner looks great.

Roy

[JTR70]

Thank you Roy! It is a very nice feeling to now look down into the back seat area safe in the knowledge that there is nothing more I need to do.
Thanks again!
Justin
Right rear quarter panel installation.
Tying up all those loose ends in the engine compartment and rear seat area now frees my mind up to get back on body panels.

I'll be putting the ass end back on the stand to install the quarter panel but while I was still free to turn the car on its side I finished attaching the cowl.

And the lateral closing strip up to the striker. More tedious stuff out of the way.

My initial assessment of this panel when I first mounted it a few weeks back was that it would need a lot more work than the other side to fit correctly but as I've worked with it more this afternoon I'm realizing that I misjudged it and that its only off badly in one aspect in particular. What can I say, just have to chalk it up to my inexperience.

Fast forward to this afternoon with the panel remounted for final fitment.

By sessions end this was my best average initial fit.

Top of panel with top of door a little tall but close.

Continuation of the leading lip of the cowl profile within the margin.

mating flanges in close.

Deck lid opening a bit out and swings wide but I'm thinking I might be able to manipulate that in better.

Wheel arch also very close with the rocker on the long side this time around.

Just like with fitting the other fender a lot all going on at once. So with all those other "planets" slowly aligning my leading edge is tapering back as it makes its way down. Its not even close.

At first I was thinking maybe it was out elsewhere but once I brought the leading edge up into alignment with the door with the flange interlocked into the striker like it should the rolled wired edge of the fender well was encroaching into the body plug hole. It was confirmed, the leading edge was rolled in just a few degrees off kilter. I'll have to cut it and add in a sliver filler strip here.

Again, like the other side general contour shape and consistency off the back of the door will also have to be worked in.

As it goes I'll also need to measure and double check that the fender arch opening is level (or at least close) with matching raked profile as the left fender. Lots to do!!
Thanks for looking!
Justin

[JTR70]

5/14/16
Rear fender braces.
In prep for mounting the right rear fender now was as good a time as any to finish and mount the rear braces.

Matching new and original as closely as possible for length and angle.

close enough...

Time to weld up the new tip I made with final length and shape established.

Done.

bolted in for good on this left side as all early T1's were.

The brace is now set but I'm holding off committing on the tang until the tail skin is set.

trimming for length and mount angle with the OG brace.

Brace positioned according the left side and a cross check with the OG right brace on my coupe.

Ready to weld.

It will be nice to have the brace in first to help with fender fitment but its also a lot easier to weld it on without that panel in the way.
Thanks for stopping by!
Justin

[JTR70]

5/16/16
Continue fitting the right rear fender. Checking for wheel well opening consistency from left to right.

Wasn't sure how I was going to approach cross checking them at first. Measure off the floor? Finally settled on clamping my straight edge to the car with a cardboard template. Straight edge was mounted level and even with the rockers door edge opening creating my baseline.

Template was traced, cut to shape then clamped back into place. It was now time to mount this over on the other side to see how off they are at the moment.

Straight edge was flipped over and mounted in the same location on the right rocker. Much to my great relief and surprise they are pretty damned close!

This side is higher and at its widest its better than a half-inch.

...or about 15mm for JOP. Another confirmation too was that openings are very even in relation to one another.

I'm thinking once I get more of this excess removed and trimmed out the this fender should settle down a bit more tightening up this variance between these two sides. Thinking back to the inconsistencies Jack described finding on OG B&C cars from left to right I have to believe these openings also varied a bit from side to side originally. I hope this is within tolerance other more nip and tucking required.
Thanks for looking!
Justin

[JOP]

Morgen Builder-Justin,

That was a nice metod and accurate way of checking the openings
It is also very cheap and I guess all guys have acces to cardboard and a looooong ruler.
To many 356 are done with diffrent shapes on left and right sides.....

I also have done templets and taken alot of photos with measuring tape in them to get some info where to get the right settings. Ofcourse taken on a good original 356.

Thx 4 sharing a new way
/JOP

[roy mawbey]

I agree with Jop a very nice way of checking both sides. Really good datum with the rocker top and they are so close. I bet you were as pleased as punch Justin.

Yet another body check I will remember

Roy

[bbspdstr]

Roy, I find I cannot remember what day it is unless I must write a check. Good luck with remembering body alignments and measurements.

For selfish reasons, I am hoping that Justin produces a book of his trials and tribulations with this project. Words are good, but pictures?...that's for me!

The problem of which I am a part is jumping from thread to thread and then getting lost, not remembering what I saw on which thread and when it was posted. The sometimes bad, sometimes great hijacking or just off-topic posting of/on a thread makes for more confusion and this is exacerbated by the growth of the site.

I have Steve Heinrich's books. I read most of the words but really get the most out of the illustrations. Here as well. However, as the younger set has me saying lately; "It's all good."

-Bruce