'63 356B T-6 Rebuild

[John Pierce]

Hi Group and Happy Father's Day!

I'm in need of some electrical expertise.

I'm planning on converting my B T6 to 12 volt and have a chance to buy a Bosch "skinny" small diameter generator. My engine is a 1963 S-90 with a 6 volt generator. What are the issues that I will run into here? Is this the appropriate generator to buy and if so what is a reasonable price?

Thanks.

John

[bbspdstr]

This is an area where there is still a lot of VW-356 cross-over.

There are still some "skinny" VW 12v generators or early 912 generators or VW generator guts to be had. I send core 6v Porsche versions to a very good local old-school rebuilder and they do a reliable result that can look and function as new, stamped as 12v to avoid confusion.

I give them the core and my Ab Tiedemann tool for the special countersunk machine screws that hold the thing together. I get the barrel back for blasting and wire-brushing and send it off (again locally) for plating. I then send the plated main part to the rebuilders and they do bearings and paint the ends, assembled and tested.

(The approach is the same for both 6v and 12v when a complete engine gets the 'beautification treatment,' especially on a complete overhaul of the engine.)

The cost: including the VW 12v armature and plating takes the cost to me just north of $300 with a good core.

Going from there downstream, you can send $400 for a rectangular black early style Bosch MB or a converted look-alike voltage regulator or less than $300 for a Bosch smaller 12v new regulator or you can get the transistorized version for under a hundred, but the latter doesn't look "original." Keep in mind that most regulators in such a conversion won't be adjustable and likely won't extinguish the red light on the combo gauge until about 1500 rpm.

Speaking of combo, you will need to either rebuild that gauge to be 12v for the oil temp and gas level segments or get a heavy duty voltage reducer that can be hidden and used for the wiper motor as well.

12v wiper motors can be had for about $400, but the rheostat switch is still the problem in that system. The switch can take the 12v (half the amps of 6v) but the wiper speed is "fast" or "kill" unless both are fed 6v.

None of this is a big deal, but I give people choices...the first is that for about the cost of a 12v conversion, a good wiring harness can be bought, allowing 6v to operate "like new" and the second is to assess their wiring and clean and recon a decent old harness and go ahead with the 12v conversion (it was offered in your year as an option)...and the third choice is to do both a new harness and the 12v.

Better access to bulbs and accessories, better lighting, etc. Original radios were either/or, clocks don't much care either and a new battery is about the same cost whether Group 1 6v or a similar-sized 12v. Coils, as well. Many bulbs can be LED and avoid the heat in dome lights, dash lights, etc. The function is better and difficult to tell it's not "original" overall.

Hope this helps,
Happy Father's Day to all (where applicable),
-Bruce

[John Pierce]

A little progress.



Trial fitting the toe board mounts. Making sure the accelerator pedal and connecting rods all move appropriately without binding.



Pedal cluster also mocked up with the toe boards. That's Tom's passenger side toe board with his great idea of a storage hatch. It's nicely made with all the mounting harding sitting flush.



Everything welded up and primered.



I believe that the floor pan in now complete!! It's been quite the trip to get to this point. Woot!!

Thanks for following.

[Phil Planck]

John
You did a great job. Really looks nice. I saw Tom's board advertised somewhere(Samba?). Foam Car had a fuel pump behind that board. Would make nice access to it if I decide to keep it there.

[356JAGER]

John, Amazing workmanship. As to plating I've had excellent results from
these folks. http://www.shermsplating.com/
Cheers,
Joel

[Jack Staggs]

A little progress.



Trial fitting the toe board mounts. Making sure the accelerator pedal and connecting rods all move

John, is that a crack just above the hand throttle mechanism, and to the right of the brake light wiring hole?
You may want to re-fit the pedal assy with the clutch cable installed to check for interference to the throttle rod. Sometimes a problem. While you are at it, install the wood toe boards and the rubber floor mat that you intend to use. The cut out slots for the brake and clutch pedal on the floor mat often are not centered to the pedal shafts and can drag enough to keep the pedals from fully returning. A slight adjustment to the pedal box can effect a cure. Trimming of the rubber is a last resort.
Been there on all this with finished cars.

[John Pierce]

Thanks guys!



Good eyes Jack. You had me worried Bubba did something to my new metal! Just a trick of the lighting though, as it's just an electrical tab. I also was worried about the clutch cable through that tight area so that was also mocked up during fitment. When I welded the tunnel and front pedal supports I made sure there was good clearance through that area. Good idea about the rubber pads. Thanks.


John

[John Pierce]

I had to take the seats apart to get to the pans for fitment of the pods. I figured I'd finish that project up before moving onto more metal work.



Seat pan upon disassembly. Just surface rust.



Media blasted cleaned it up nicely.



Epoxy primed and top coated. I didn't want to remove the seat rail as it is barely seen so I'll paint it a zinc color later.



The seat back frame was never primered or painted. I was surprised that it didn't have more surface rust after 50 years.



It cleaned up nicely.



Epoxy primed and painted.



The rear seats have metal attachments screwed into wood. I'll have to make new wood pieces as they are a bit punky.



Seat risers turned out nicely.



My ad hoc drying rack.

Thanks for following.

JP

[Phil Planck]

John
Nice break from body work. Also nice to be able to work on a bench. Good idea doing that while it is fresh in your mind. I tore my seats down years ago back in the Polaroid camera days, Hope I can find everything when the time comes. As usual, quality work. I just used my overhead garage door track to hang my primed sway bar. Had to paint one half at a time, as no way to hang it without wet paint touching something that I could figure out.
Phil

[John Pierce]

The next section I need to work on is making and installing new hinge stand-offs for which I need to use the doors as jigs. The doors, like the rest of the car, however, are a bit thread-worn so I'm starting their restoration.



The left door is not too bad. A few dents, stress cracks, a few small holes along the bottom and a salt eaten front reinforcement. Like most 356's the bump stop was also caved in.



Getting to this dented area was quite the feat. Not much room to work in.



Template for the salt eaten reinforcement plate. It's a curved piece in 2 planes necessitating a couple of reliefs.



The old piece removed, media blasted and rust converted.



Replacement panel ready for welding. I could fit the spot welder into the door cavity for some of the welds, but had to use rosette welds elsewhere.



New metal always looks great. The stress cracks were also fixed and dents removed.



The bottom rust holes were repaired and other bent metal straightened.



I had to replace the 6 mm weld nut and added 2 gussets to help prevent the bump stop from caving in in the future.



Complete and looking so much better.

Now on to the right door which is MUCH worse. The whole bottom and lower skin is hole ridden. I'll be making a jig to help me control the heat distortion.

Thanks for following.

[ukinusa]

Nice simple idea of small reinforcing gussets to help the bump stop - often these little ideas are the most useful ! Thanks

[John Pierce]

I can't take credit for the bump stop gusset, which was Tom Perazzo's idea. I did add a second gusset on either side of the weld nut, which should spread the forces over a larger area. Thanks Tom.

[Jack Staggs]

Years ago, I added gussets to the bump stop on a few cars, as many of them were out of shape. I got to thinking about it and wondered "If I beef this up, and stop in Pearsonville, Ca. where the Mojave winds really get going, what could happen when I open the door and a 40+ MPH wind catches the door and flings it wide open (a common occurrence there! )? Somethings gonna give, so I decided that it is far better to have the bump stop give way, than the door frame, hinge mounts, mount pillar, or worse. Ever see cracks on the inner door frame near the hinges, usually at the upper hinge area? I have. I attribute this to severe misalignment of the hinges, so that every time the door is opened or closed, there is a bit of flex, or bending, of the door frame. After time, cracks occur, like bending a beer can back and forth until it breaks. Fitting a long 5/16" or 8mm shaft through the door and body hinges separately will reveal how far things can get out of whack. Correct as needed BEFORE PAINT! Slight deviations are expected...

[John Pierce]

Good thoughts Jack. My left door had a stress crack near the upper hinge AND a crushed in bump stop. Looks like it lead a hard life! It'll definitely be pampered, but driven, in the future.

JP

[tperazzo]

[quote="Jack Staggs" post=34525]Years ago, I added gussets to the bump stop on a few cars, as many of them were out of shape. I got to thinking about it and wondered "If I beef this up, and stop in Pearsonville, Ca. where the Mojave winds really get going, what could happen when I open the door and a 40+ MPH wind catches the door and flings it wide open (a common occurrence there! )? Somethings gonna give, so I decided that it is far better to have the bump stop give way, than the door frame, hinge mounts, mount pillar, or worse. Ever see cracks on the inner door frame near the hinges, usually at the upper hinge area? I have. I attribute this to severe misalignment of the hinges, so that every time the door is opened or closed, there is a bit of flex, or bending, of the door frame. After time, cracks occur, like bending a beer can back and forth until it breaks. Fitting a long 5/16" or 8mm shaft through the door and body hinges separately will reveal how far things can get out of whack. Correct as needed BEFORE PAINT! Slight deviations are expected...[/quote

Is there a recommended method for rebuilding the hinges? My drivers side is worn out with significant play when I lift the end of the door up and down. Are oversized pins available? Or bushing sleeves to press in? Inquiring minds want to know.
Thanks,
Tom