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1959 356A S/R coupe project chassis # 108625

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  • Firewall repair patch. Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9169.jpg Views:	0 Size:	460.8 KB ID:	113128 To further the final fitment of this new panel its now time to begin drawing it in tightly against the firewall flange, but as you can see its too thin, rusty and weak in this area to be able to do that.
    Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9175.jpg Views:	0 Size:	586.1 KB ID:	113129 A new repair strip with flange added harvested from the remains of the old original door skin.
    Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9176.jpg Views:	0 Size:	609.1 KB ID:	113130 Noted detail features added were an arched relief for the decklid release conduit, a slight kick at the top with a wrinkle in the flange that acts a drain for any moisture that finds its way down deep in behind here. Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9188.jpg Views:	0 Size:	564.3 KB ID:	113131 All A-coupes have this feature where these three separate panels intersect. This is a shot of the right side of this car showing this drain.
    Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9189.jpg Views:	0 Size:	585.5 KB ID:	113132 And its not just a T2 feature, my late T1 coupe also has it as well. Its an easily overlooked detail, I missed it years ago during an early repair attempt.
    Last edited by JTR70; 08-01-2022, 08:03 PM.
    Justin Rio

    Comment


    • Patch installation.
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ID:	113134 Firewall ready for final trim.
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ID:	113135 Still debating on either removing or welding onto this (pointer) strip of overlapping arch. It would be much simpler and cleaner to cut it straight across like most it but its very tight and difficult to get down in behind it for removal. It will become clearer as it goes.
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ID:	113136 Final trim and final clean. All remaining rust down in that corner was heat treated and wire brushed as best as possible.
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ID:	113137 All stitched in.
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ID:	113138 Now I have an attachment flange strong enough to draw in the new panel tightly. A little more prep work in the done column.

      More later...
      Thanks for looking.
      Justin
      Justin Rio

      Comment


      • Another Detour:
        Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9185.jpg Views:	0 Size:	443.3 KB ID:	113162 While wrapping the fire wall patch a small spec to the right of the shock mount caught my attention. It seemed like a raised bit of remnant tar at first but once I probed it with this tip it gave way and revealed what it actually was . Then the other hole next to this tip in this photo jumped out. The seriousness of these tiny holes is that this gusset plate is at least 16 gauge, some of the thickest wall metal that was used in these car's entire construction. If the rust has thinned and breached this plate the much thinner frame wall its sandwiched over has to be badly compromised if not entirely rusted away underneath here. It would be tempting just to weld these holes closed and leave this sleeping dog lay but I know its weak and more breaches are coming highlighted by the green circles. The rust is growing post media blast and primer. BTW: I went over the right side gusset plate and it is intact. There is most definitely some rust under it as well but nothing serious enough to justify disturbing it.
        Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65651.jpg Views:	3 Size:	483.8 KB ID:	113163Drilling out the numerous spot welds for removal.
        Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65652.jpg Views:	3 Size:	700.9 KB ID:	113164Shock mount's root anchor located just above parcel shelf will need to be cut for removal. Thankfully there is always clear access to it.
        Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65653.jpg Views:	3 Size:	531.3 KB ID:	113165 Once the prying began a lot of rust scale and sand began to emerge.
        Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65654.jpg Views:	3 Size:	439.7 KB ID:	113166 First look under this plate. The much thinner gauge frame walls condition was exactly what I had expected.
        Last edited by JTR70; 08-04-2022, 06:10 PM.
        Justin Rio

        Comment


        • Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9204.jpg Views:	0 Size:	638.7 KB ID:	113168 If that heavy gusset was rusting through this thinner wall had to be toast, no surprises.
          Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65656.jpg Views:	3 Size:	545.3 KB ID:	113169 A lot of rust scale fell out during removal but there still much more behind it.
          Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65657.jpg Views:	3 Size:	696.5 KB ID:	113170 In the end a considerable pile of rust and sand that had no chance of escaping this cavity.
          Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65658.jpg Views:	3 Size:	597.7 KB ID:	113171 I'd like to save this original gusset but it maybe too thin and weak. We'll what remains after an acid bath.

          Thanks for looking.
          Justin
          Last edited by JTR70; 08-04-2022, 06:11 PM.
          Justin Rio

          Comment


          • Dear Justin, your level of commitment to saving metal and preserving what Porsche built is genuinely amazing. What a journey, and so much effort! But the final result will be done to a standard more akin to art conservation than just “automobile restoration”. I doff my cap to you sir. John

            Comment


            • JTR70
              JTR70 commented
              Editing a comment
              Hi John, Thank you very much for that nice comment. I try my best to replicate what I see as closely as I can with the simple tools and resources I have available to me. Sometimes it works and sometimes I have to leave well enough alone. Thank you once again, I greatly appreciate it Sir!

          • Cutting past remaining wall rot.
            Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9252.jpg Views:	0 Size:	662.8 KB ID:	113198
            Initial cut line taped out. Trying to get past the rot while keeping the final weld joint under the new gusset plate as much as possible for addtional support.
            Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65674.jpg Views:	3 Size:	622.3 KB ID:	113199 Initial cut. I may have to remove a little more as it goes but keeping the patch as small as I can for now. I vacuumed out this cavity and sediment still continues to accumulate.
            Click image for larger version  Name:	image_65675.jpg Views:	3 Size:	596.3 KB ID:	113200 Well, after a few hours in the acid it was becoming apparent that the original plate is too thin and compromised to reuse especially in and around the shank.
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ID:	113201 This car defies the usual rust patterns and the rules of gravity. This vertical heavy plate is shot but the original rear seat pan underneath it survived nearly intact save for a few small pin holes. A new gusset was ordered but this old one will be a great hammer form for the new wall section patch.
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ID:	113202 A quick paper template to establish the basic size needed.
            Last edited by JTR70; 08-15-2022, 09:19 PM.
            Justin Rio

            Comment


            • Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9261.jpg Views:	0 Size:	577.7 KB ID:	113204 Onto steel. As this is part of the "frame" 18 gauge sheet will be used for the patch.
              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9262.jpg Views:	0 Size:	600.8 KB ID:	113205 Trimmed back to basic size and clamped to the old gusset in preparation for some heat and hammer forming.
              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9263.jpg Views:	0 Size:	603.3 KB ID:	113206 First round of head and hammering. Relief cutting at the top to make the 90 degree bend that's needed.
              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9264.jpg Views:	0 Size:	658.7 KB ID:	113207 Very rough rudimentary patch panel but it was a good start. The old gusset proved invaluable as the hammer form.
              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9265.jpg Views:	0 Size:	516.9 KB ID:	113208 Much more shaping and trimming as it goes as its a fairly complex shape. 18 gauge sheet adds even a little more challenge.
              Last edited by JTR70; 08-15-2022, 09:34 PM.
              Justin Rio

              Comment


              • Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9270.jpg Views:	0 Size:	529.5 KB ID:	113210 Next round of trimming and hammer forming to tighten up the shape a little further.
                Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9271.jpg Views:	0 Size:	482.5 KB ID:	113211 Fits a little better every time. Overlap has been trimmed back on the upper relief cuts and are just about ready to be stitched together.
                Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9272.jpg Views:	0 Size:	485.8 KB ID:	113212 Inching closer to the final cut line. Outline templates taped here to locate those trim lines. Still left a little meat for any last minute adjustments.
                Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9273.jpg Views:	0 Size:	528.3 KB ID:	113213 New top flange welded back together. As you can see the flange doesn't run straight across and has to taper downward to follow the contour of the chassis for a tight fit.
                Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9274.jpg Views:	0 Size:	524.2 KB ID:	113214 I have one more 90 step to add into this flange but its getting close. After all the bending and trimming it was a relief to see the knockout hole maintain its alignment with the squared inner root mounting hole for the shank.
                final shaping and fitment continues...
                Thanks for looking!
                Justin
                Last edited by JTR70; 08-15-2022, 09:57 PM.
                Justin Rio

                Comment


                • All I can say Justin is just how many restored cars are running around with that particular problem lurking there ! I bet for sure many have overlooked that area. A few pin holes cover them up!! Well done indeed not a straight forward repair to get into.

                  Great photos.

                  Roy

                  Comment


                  • JTR70
                    JTR70 commented
                    Editing a comment
                    I think there are many beautifully restored cars with issues like this tucked away down deep Roy. Overlooked, left behind on purpose due to the confines of a restoration budget. Knowing what I do now, whatever your situation is, putting all your resources towards the chassis should first and foremost. If the body is still raggedy and the drivetrain still apart or incomplete etc etc.; If you run out of money or desire by the time the frame is done you're still in the drivers seat with a very desirable and honest project car to sell if that decision came. Thanks Roy!

                • Frame patch installation:
                  Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9282.jpg Views:	0 Size:	581.8 KB ID:	113219 Set screwed into final position along the internal bulkhead flange. The original wasn't secured this high up along this flange but it will be this time around. Clamped at the top and ready for a final bend.
                  Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9283.jpg Views:	0 Size:	659.9 KB ID:	113220 Last fold added to the upper flange.
                  Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9285.jpg Views:	0 Size:	609.4 KB ID:	113221 Lots of clean up yet to do before its ready but I finally had a basic repair patch set at this point.
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ID:	113222 Another round of hammer forming against the old gusset to tighten the lines just a little more.
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ID:	113223 Went over the surface rust and scale in the cavity with my torch to burn-off as much as possible. Then first coat of rust converter/inhibitor applied here.

                  Last edited by JTR70; 08-22-2022, 09:33 PM.
                  Justin Rio

                  Comment


                  • Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9294.jpg Views:	0 Size:	583.8 KB ID:	113225 A top coat of sealer was brushed in next. All but ready to close this are up.
                    Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9295.jpg Views:	0 Size:	496.3 KB ID:	113226 New panel tacked into final position.
                    Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9298.jpg Views:	0 Size:	571.8 KB ID:	113227 All stitched in. Had some blow through I had to chase in spots but for the most part the perimeter of the old wall was thick enough to throw enough penetrating heat at.
                    Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9300.jpg Views:	0 Size:	615.5 KB ID:	113228 Welds finished. The frame wall is now ready to accept a new gusset plate/ upper shock mount.
                    Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9301.jpg Views:	0 Size:	620.6 KB ID:	113229 I'd love to save and remount the old one but its too thin. However, I will be reusing the original eyelet even though the kit comes with a new one. Waiting on that to arrive to finish this repair.

                    Thanks for looking.

                    Justin
                    Justin Rio

                    Comment


                    • Great Justin, another bit almost out of the way.

                      Roy

                      Comment


                      • JTR70
                        JTR70 commented
                        Editing a comment
                        Thanks again Roy! Yes, one step closer to getting back on track.

                    • New gusset and shock mount kit arrives:
                      Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9326.jpg Views:	0 Size:	557.7 KB ID:	113242 Its a close reproduction but not what I was hoping for. The gusset plate is only 18 gauge and not an equivalent 16 gauge like the original.
                      Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9327.jpg Views:	0 Size:	542.9 KB ID:	113243 Another issue was the draw in the relief shape being way too shallow.
                      Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9324.jpg Views:	0 Size:	502.7 KB ID:	113244 Too shallow by almost a quarter inch.
                      Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9335.jpg Views:	0 Size:	478.9 KB ID:	113245 Fits into the original foot print okay but the larger problem is with this shallow draw and if its not corrected its going to hold the eventual eyelet out too far; about a quarter inch out too far. The inner anchor shank will come up short and there could be some tire/rim clearance issues with the shock if it was all mounted with this plate dictating the eyelet's position without correction.
                      Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9333.jpg Views:	0 Size:	561.8 KB ID:	113246 No sense in putting all of that correction time into a new part that's too thin to begin with. I decided to repair the original unit and send this kit back.


                      Last edited by JTR70; 08-28-2022, 08:55 AM.
                      Justin Rio

                      Comment


                      • Original gusset/shock mount repair:
                        Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9329.jpg Views:	0 Size:	617.9 KB ID:	113248 Adding mass back in around the shank with weld and patching where the holes where too big to bridge and fill. Used 16 gauge for the patches with a lot of torch heat as it went to get the needed shape and contour.
                        Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_9332.jpg Views:	0 Size:	651.2 KB ID:	113249 Strength and rigidity quickly returned after a few passes. Had a nice bell tone to it at the end. Note the casting numbers in the shank.
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ID:	113250 Went over the patch joints with my torch for a thorough meld.
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ID:	113251 Original gusset repairs complete. I feel much better about saving this original.
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ID:	113252 Epoxy brushed along areas where it has the best chance of surviving after welding and reinstallation. That next...

                        Thanks for stopping by!

                        Justin
                        Last edited by JTR70; 08-28-2022, 09:19 AM.
                        Justin Rio

                        Comment


                        • Justin, I had a 5 year press toolmaking apprenticeship in the late 50's / early 60's. I can't quite understand how they made the effort to produce that part but in the wrong gauge and with that depression being so far out of spec. Sure far easier to use the thinner gauge ,but who took the measurements I wonder. This makes you wonder about so many repro pieces around , that if you have no reference to an original like you always seem to have, or another car to inspect, so many problems are lurking there ready to pounce, when you weld these bought in items presuming they are perfect copies.
                          I told you I guess 5 years ago you should write a book on your experiences restoring a 356. Of course the number of 356 cars now worth saving are far less than years ago so I reckon it would not be worth such an effort from a cash point of view. I wonder how many guys follow these great step by step remedies of yours like I do?

                          Super photos again!
                          Roy


                          Comment


                          • JTR70
                            JTR70 commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Thanks Roy, I really appreciate your encouragement for something like that but as you say there aren't a whole lot of project cars around like there was in even the last 20 years. As an apprentice in that industry I know you have better understanding of this than I certainly do. My guess is that if they can get away with what their offering then there is no pressure to retool. However this wasn't cheap at a 130 bucks for the two pieces so they will be going back. Floor pans, longitudinal sections and most other chassis related repair offerings come in the much lighter 20 gauge. As you said, its easier to press and to install and work with but its too light for chassis parts. But it does end up stronger than a rusted original in the end.
                            Last edited by JTR70; 08-31-2022, 08:23 AM.
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