57 356 A mild resto

[bbspdstr]

Don, absolutely there is a difference.

ANYTHING that makes the car "like new" in "feel" of the driving experience is a plus.

On the bigger resto jobs I have been hired to do, the edict is usually this: "I want to believe I have a time machine and can go back to a Porsche showroom in 19XX and buy a new 356 of my choice."

Therefore, the driving, the quietness (or none, depending on model)...the steering (no worn steering box 'sawing'), the suspension (I try to sell at least new rear torsion bars and bushings), the original power (at least) from the engine, really good brakes (like new), a smooth gearbox, properly padded seats, good electric circuitry, windows that operate as they did when new....every little thing including a new windshield (looking through a new glass has a great psychological impact on the person who just wrote all those checks) ...to taking them back to when new 356s were really cool cars.

If sound-deadener is done well, at least as good as the tar paper and true asphaltic undercoat Porsche used, even a radio can be enjoyed and the old rationale of "Hey, who needs a radio...just listen to the sound of the exhaust!" can be optional and overall, the 356 can be more original!

I have been using the Eastwood version of Dynamat. Little difference in workability and slightly cheaper...and any of it is covered with carpet and interior or rubber mats of some sort.

-Bruce

[Don C]

Bruce,
Do you notice any difference in the quietness inside the car with either Dynamat or original tar paper/jute?
My car was stripped of all insulation and over time I'm trying to make it quieter.
Thanks!
Regards,
Don

[bbspdstr]

"Did you guys use seam sealer on the fender rolled inner lip that houses the wire or leave it open to breath?"

While right-side-up, I soak the fender wire rolled bead at the top of arch with a thinned urethane to saturate the area and catch the run-off with cans to re-pour. Messy but the whole idea is not to trap or cover any rust but "encapsulate" it so the rust cannot grow. If any is missed, it IS better to "let it breathe."

More and more wired edges are getting opened and rust repaired and often new wires installed due to the plain ol' "times a-goin' by." I didn't need to do that much in the '60s and '70 or even '80s.....but here we are in 2017 and it's said that "rust never sleeps."

Porsche didn't go out of it's way to protect those areas, so even 20 years was better than the same areas on my 10 year old Dodge truck.

As for the inside once all is done, I usually paint with a black urethane primer over minimal seam-sealer in needed areas. Save the texture for the trunk (boot), engine bay and underside. Sometimes Dynamat sound-deadener is indicated, sometimes tar paper.....and I like the die-cut kits the best, but those are expensive!

-Bruce

[merbesfield]

Mark
The pedal assembly "frame" has 3 slotted holes that your under pan bracket bolts go through



You can see one above

Ah, now I understand. For ease of installation into car. Thanks, Mark

[foamcar]

Mark
The pedal assembly "frame" has 3 slotted holes that your under pan bracket bolts go through



You can see one above

[merbesfield]

Thank you gentlemen. I hope my round embossment is in the right spot. I have time to move things if I need to. Not sure what Phil means about the holes being slotted tho. Exciting to be getting closer.

A couple of othe questions.
Did you guys use seam sealer on the fender rolled inner lip that houses the wire or leave it open to breath?

Did you guys spray undercoating on the inside floors? I know these cars originally had tar sheets and the later 911 got undercoating aka Stone guard. Just wondering what I should do to inside once buttoned up. Not going for concours original, more interested in preservation and sound control. Thanks Mark

[foamcar]

Mark
I've only done this once, but if your tunnel and inner long. flanges are in the correct elevation, you should be able to weld the pan in without regard to the pedal assembly. Once the pan welding is done, the pedal assembly can be bolted to the bulkhead with the m/c studs so you can determine where to drill the 3 holes for your bracket. Keep in mind that the holes in the pedal assembly for the bracket bolts are actually slots. That is because you install the m/c studs first, then rotate the pedal assembly down over the bracket bolts, thus the need for the slots.
Phil

[JTR70]

So glad you were able to help yourself out here Mark.

Here's a shot of my factory undisturbed bracket though don't expect that round embossment to be in the right spot on the new floor.

[merbesfield]

[merbesfield]

I am in the shop today trying to knock down cob webs and get back at the car. Silly how long I let this sit for how close the pans are to being in. But life has its challenges. I am trying to remember something I read about making sure the pedal cluster is positioned properly before welding the pan in place. Is it just that simple, mock it up first or are there other points to be checked before welding the pan in? Thanks for the help. Mark

[merbesfield]

Mark,
Are you sure that's a 741 transmission? By the view of the underside of the tunnel it doesn't look like a 741 shift linkage.

It is stamped 741. That is part of my question. I don't know what part is correct but someone who knows more than me said it was mixed and matched linkage. For clarification, car is early 57 T1, engine is 69 912 and transmission is 741.

Most likely, it is a 741 with a 644 'nose' and selector that then works with the earlier shift linkage. T-1 torsion bar tubes have a solid center that precludes the formed dent in the center bottom for shifter clearance of the B/C cars. T-2 A cars have a hollow center that allows the top 'dent' to be replicated from underneath once a window is made for access. Heat-n-beat with a rounded air-hammer head and use all 741 shifter compontents to get rid of the 'monkey-motion' early shifting. Some just exit the trans and support the shift tube above the tunnel, but that's 'racer stuff.'

-Bruce

I wanted to follow up on this post. Here are pics of my transmission. I do see 741/2 stamped on it. My engine is a 69 912. The car is a T1 A.

[bbspdstr]

"be sure all old grease is cleaned out as it could melt causing the obvious problems"

Grease in the tubes for heater, e-brakes and clutch will only ooze out of the ends if it gets too warm (hot) in there and your welding has an insulating air gap if heat is only from a bottom flange on the tunnel and the new floor and doing a 'lacing' of plug welds when jumping around in a sequence.

Still, the most illustrative way the cars were built is on "Made by Hand." The tunnel/floor and rear bulkhead were "the first body parts down the line" and then the whole shell was built and painted prior to ANY mechanical assembly. Sure, those people who assembled the 356 did the same things on each car, day after day, became "specialists" and things like the spring for the e-brake retraction were no big deal....BUT, it's doable with patience and ingenuity, even for guys like you and me doing that once or a hundred times.

Look at each challenge as I do.....another reason to invent or reuse a bunch of dark oaths.

I came up with some new combinations of bad words yesterday when I got under the dash of an A. I had previously noted that the handle for the fuel valve had too much slop due to a cotter pin that was too thin. I said I would take care of it because it was a touchy compromise. I got distracted and when I came back, the same tech had jumped ahead and put in a cotter pin that was too big, so the geometry of the two parts and the angle and lack of freedom to turn as if a universal joint put pressure on the rotating part of the fuelcock and made a leak in the fresh rebuild of the original valve and a mess to clean up.

I got to do it all over again for free. Drain the tank, remove the valve, add a new cork disc and shim the spring. That is a 'word to the wise'...some things that look easy, aren't. Other procedures that look difficult really aren't...but in every case, one learns by doing and/or reading the experiences of those who have gone before, like here.

-Bruce

[foamcar]

Can't speak for the A , but on my T6B it was easy to install the heater wires with the pan installed. Also easy to fill ebrake cable tubes with grease from rear openings prior to installing cables. Was easy to disconnect cables below shifter with pan in. Have not reconnected yet, as still work to do on "spreader bar adjustment" at shoes, but don't forsee a problem. I did push out grease from the tubes when installing ebrake cables.
Phil

[merbesfield]

Gentlemen, John in his thread shows that he injected grease into his tubes prior to installing his pan. Bruce mentioned above to be sure all old grease is cleaned out as it could melt causing the obvious problems. I see that my original E brake cables have a grease nipple. Never having installed these before, only removing. I don't see why the grease couldn't be pumped into the conduit after welding, but my concern is the limited access via topside of tunnel. The E brake pull block and spring looks like it will be tough to connect from above through that small hole. The wires for the heater pull cables looks equally tough to do all this inside the tunnel. Could these things be installed and then grease pumped in after welding? Or would that take forever? This is one of those items where you old timers know all the tricks and us newbies can learn if we ask the right questions. Thx for the help. Mark

[bbspdstr]

Geez Phil....next you will be installing a sensor for an electric speedometer....

Actually, while being asked more and more to reverse 'improvements' in 356s to "originality" (think Webers back to Solexes, 356 race cars back to original street car form), I am all for betterments that do not require any modification to the basic 356 (think full-flow filters, third brake lights, LED bulbs, whole 12v systems, alternators and the like).
Keeping records with pictures and notes and the parts of what was original is an absolute must....as we all know that nothing is forever. We also know, especially here on Justin's forum, that 356s were designed and built to be driven!
(Still need a bit of wiring harness?)
Regards,
-Bruce