My starter motor

[roy mawbey]

Guys,

Huge success. Finished fitting it yesterday and hot or cold it turns just like a new 12volt not 6volt! I am delighted with the result. I have never in 47 years heard the motor spin so fast. So before I go any further again just for UK people with starter of dynamo problems the guy to speak to is Rob at Broadway Electrical services in Essex tel: 01375 372 782.

The fitting of the starter with the engine in car is not easy. I have now the way to do it and it works I will describe that in a later post.

I have the photo's now to send:
1 - 3 These are the pics of Rob's efforts which included taking off the solinoid cap with the rivets and inserting screws and nuts. The interior of the solinoid and its 3 copper contacts were very poor. they are now good. He changed the brushes for new and sent me the old ones. There were 4 brushes? I thought my motor had only 2. Phil please look at the photo I took 2 years ago and advise me if it looks like a 4 brush set?

There is a photo of the solinoid still on the motor when I removed it from the car. I can see the heated up bottom connector. It had welded itself to the washer and he cut the nut off. He sent that back too!!

One tip for those taking out and fitting the motor with engine in car,

The nut behind the fanhousing to undo needs a flat swivel head ratchet thin wall full circle spanner. On re-fitting blue tack the top long bolt onto the top of the starter motor casing with the bolt sticking 45mm out from the top starter flange hole.

When you lift it vertical the bolt stays in place and then tip horizontal push forward with the bottom location hole in line with the bottom stud. The starter shaft locates into the bushing and it guides the top bolt into the transmission hole.

Move over the left side of the car and find a area to get your hand onto the bolt head and get a friend to put on the nut in the engine bay.

One final thing before you push the motor up vertically undo the wiring loom clips and move the loom out of the way to give more room.












Roy

[Phil Planck]

Great news Roy, and thanks for all of the installation tips. Is the first picture in your last post the 2 year old one? I see no others in this topic.. If so, that is 4 brush version.

Phil

[roy mawbey]

Phil,

That is the pic I took about 2 years ago of the motor brushes, I can see 2 brushes but not 4. I am bemused by that. I don't see where the other 2 brushes go. I have the 4 old used ones and the old cut off nut and washer its was welded to all returned. I never took off the end cap before sending him the motor so maybe I just missed seeing the other 2 brushes two years ago??

I blame it all on my age

I would say if Mic has the same solinoid as mine with riveted on end cap has anyone removed those to look inside at the copper contacts?
Has he solved his motor problem?

Roy

[Phil Planck]

Roy

Maybe this will help:

[roy mawbey]

Phil.

I guess a couple of years ago I did not see the opening under the back cap for the 2nd set below the top ones! I know I checked the brush length at that time and it was okay. I must be just confused/ Thanks Phil for the layout of the later 356A starter. I have never seen that before only the previous 2 brush version.

He told me he had used his last full set on my starter and I got four used brushes back.

Cheers again

Roy

[roy mawbey]

Info for Mark:-

Mark,

The sad story began about 37 years ago. The car when purchased nearly 48 years ago had a fast starter from my memory only! Over the years I tried everything as the cranking speed went slower and slower especially when hot. You can see the information that you requested on Phil's thread, if you look at these 3 pages.

I can say the motor is now perfect as good and fast as my BMW 12 volt. You have a 57 A. It will have a 2 brush system and I think the exact same solinoid as mine. The end cap of the solinoid is riveted on and inside this are 3 copper contacts. The bottom contact carries current through the flat copper strap ( on the lower solinoid threaded stud ) to the starter motor outer casing and then into the field windings.

In my case that stud had got so hot it welded the connections of that stud together so it had to have the nut cut off!!

Problem was the condition of the lower copper contact inside and the other remaining two contacts. They drilled out the rivets replaced with nuts and bolts and made the copper contacts like new.

The armature and field windings I thought would be poor were perfect. Remember, I had already changed the transmision bell housing bush, they changed too the rear bushing and put in 4 new brushes, the commutator was good. All those things as well as perfect earths from the battery and the transmission to body are important.

I began to think it was the long 10mm copper wire from battery to solinoid breaking down. Not so! I also thought if the solinoid pushes the pinion forward into the ring gear then that must be perfect. Not so!! I even had my ignition switch out thought maybe contacts inside.
Not so!

Mark, If you remove it and replace with the engine in place take note of my instruction. It took me skinned knuckles, the motor dropping on my head, swear words I rarely use and a headache for my wife who had to put up with me going on and on about it....
Can you buy original style solinoids? No you cannot. Later versions yes but I don't know if they fit.

I wonder if Mic has read all this??? his motor was playing up.

Roy