No announcement yet.

Installing a Convertible D Windshield

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Installing a Convertible D Windshield

    There have been many threads on Convertible D and Roadster windshields posted on the Registry forum, all of which I have read. I would like to document some of the work involved with some photographs. I have both rust repair and windshield fitting issues. First the fitting of the windshield to the frame:

    Bruce Baker talks about bending the windshield frame to fit the glass. My question is how much bending is too much, i.e. when should I send the windshield back and try one from another vendor?

    Here are a couple photos of my original clear windshield (Sigla mad in Germany) on the top and the new Stoddard Sigla tinted windshield (made by Pilkington).

    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0087.jpeg
Views:	200
Size:	88.4 KB
ID:	112593

    The size of the replacement is a good match to the original but it has less curvature at the outside edges. The contour is a good match except the outer 3" - 4" or so on each side, where the original windshield curves an additional ¼" compared to the replacement. Should the windshield frame be bent to match, or should a new windshield be procured, that is the question.

    Second problem I found when the windshield was removed. There is rust in the cowl under the vinyl, surprise! Actually I knew there was some, the rust was pushing the vinyl up. I plan to tig up the damage and have the cowl and dash repainted. Here are some photos:

    Right side near grab handle:
    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0069.jpeg
Views:	196
Size:	142.8 KB
ID:	112594

    left side:
    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0075.jpeg
Views:	186
Size:	160.7 KB
ID:	112596

    After scraping the rust off:
    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0077.jpeg
Views:	191
Size:	206.5 KB
ID:	112597

    The left side needs more paint removed, there is rust underneath:
    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0081.jpeg
Views:	186
Size:	183.9 KB
ID:	112595
    Retired software engineer
    '59 Convertible D
    '64 SC

  • #2
    The dash has been welded (and without melting all the lead I might add). I sanded the paint off the dash and cowl and hope to get it repainted next week, since it did not match the exterior paint (it was ruby red and the car is signal red).

    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0090.jpeg
Views:	174
Size:	197.7 KB
ID:	112605

    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0092.jpeg
Views:	171
Size:	161.1 KB
ID:	112603 Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0094.jpeg
Views:	165
Size:	186.2 KB
ID:	112604
    However, the priming did not go well. I learned a lesson the hard way: don't believe the auto paint store guy. I put two coats of acid etch primer on the dash, waited 15 min. then applied a coat of high build primer, which lifted. Both products were SEM, but clearly I should have waited for the acid etch primer to completely dry. So two steps forward, one back. I hate to post the photos, but at least someone may not repeat my mistake.

    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0098.jpeg
Views:	163
Size:	125.2 KB
ID:	112602 Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0100.jpeg
Views:	181
Size:	96.2 KB
ID:	112601

    Retired software engineer
    '59 Convertible D
    '64 SC


    • #3
      The cleanup and repair looks good. Could have been much, much worse. Looks like the base strip will need some love at the corners. The Roadster windshield assemblies are notoriously tricky to install successfully. That curvature variance is something new to me and is yet another challenge I hadn't thought of. I Spoke with John Chatley the Convertible D guru and he explained that when the factory was installing them on the line that the Tech would have sleeve of new windshields next to him and would pick the best one for final fitment as it went. So even then, there was a lot of issues building these units. Keep up the great progress! Justin
      Justin Rio


      • #4
        Yes, I was lucky the rust was not much worse. Battery box, a few pinholes and cracks in the floor, the shelf under the gas tank and the cowl/dash area. A friend with a roadster was here last weekend and we talked about the strange dents that were in the floor front and rear. I suspect that the car was stored in a rack and was moved around with a forklift for the last 20-30 years. I hope it is feeling loved again.

        I got the primer filler off and re-primed, this time with a different product with no issues. Need to do some block sanding then it will go to the painter next week for his approval . If he accepts the job I will get the dash and cowl painted. Hope it passes muster.
        Retired software engineer
        '59 Convertible D
        '64 SC


        • #5
          You know it is pleasing when something happens you are not expecting to see the problem detailed and with photos. As you say that advice about waiting for the surface to dry more than 15 mins , can save someone else so much time and effort.

          You are doing a nice job I am following your work.
          Well done



          • #6


            • #7
              DANG RimCanyon,
              I don't know what happened to my replay but the pics came thru.
              Guess I have some more learning to do since I have been off line for quite while.


              • #8
                Roy, thank you for the kind words. I have seen photos of your car, it is amazing to see a car so beautifully preserved and taken care of. I hope mine gets to the taking care of stage some day; right now new problems turn up every time I work on it. Just today I was working on the parking brake and could not get the passenger side to adjust. It turned out that the passenger side cable was too long, over an inch longer than the driver's side. It could never have worked, and it is not new, 20-25 years old at least. The years of neglect are at an end. I call it reversing entropy.

                Dick, thanks for the photos of your roadster with the windshield off and fresh paint! Along with the more recent picture (at Amelia?). The end result is fantastic and the beauty shows.

                I have been working on getting the car drivable, since the painter requires it. So today the pedal cluster and accelerator pedal went in and the drivers seat was pulled out of storage so I could work on the seat rails. Good thing I did it, there is a big dent in the front of the seat I will need to repair, and the seat frame needs to be repainted before taking it to AI for reupholstery.

                Now the question that is uppermost in my mind today: if I were to do the painting of the dash myself using a Preval sprayer, what paint should I use? Does it need to be the same paint that is on the car, or can I get a good blend with a different brand and type of paint? The problem is, I don't know what the car is painted with. My guess is a urethane enamel with a clear coat.

                The reason I am considering the Preval is that I also need to paint the door jambs, the hinge end of the doors, and the underside of the front trunk lid. So having the ability to do small paint jobs with the same paint that the car is painted with would solve a lot of problems.
                Retired software engineer
                '59 Convertible D
                '64 SC


                • #9

                  I would use the same paint as going on the car. A good acid etch primer, wet sand and prep. I have not has much luck with prevail sprayers. You have to thin the paint too much. My old DeVilbiss 502 touch up gun died and I ran out of rebuild kits ( just can’t find them). Bought a small cheap HVLP gun from Hazard and Fraud and it works surprising fine. It was under $20.00 and had a good pattern even coverage.

                  I would go talk to your painter or paint supplier. Figure out the paint, color and formula. I like Glasuirt or PPG single stage. When they mix the paint, I get a gallon can for the car, and a couple pint or 1/2 pint cans of the same mix for the owner or touch ups. Leave some room in the cans for activator so you can mix it in the little can. Little cans of color are a good thing. In the future.

                  I think since the outer post only have a single mount. they will adjust or twist to the differences in the glass curvature. New rubber in the upright should have enough elasticity to form to that new glass. After you put the glass seal into the frame, then you can put the outer post on and lightly screw them together and do a test fit. if the dash holes line up you should be good. I would assemble it for a loose fit, then test to see of the dash supports align with the outer post supports, and then check the bottom o f the class to see how close it is to the car. It goes on as a complete assembly with all the seals and trim in place. This will be a three guy job. After its loosely in place then check the door glass for alignment.

                  start with a loose fit it, don't force anything, its should all fit together and then drop into the dash post holes. Finger tight on the two bottom bolts, wiggling it into position to compress the lower seal. Then the top post screws last its was designed to be a quick removal to go race and put it back on. but the fit across the trunk brow and slip into the dash with no stress. Not too much torque on he lower bolts.
                  Last edited by Jbrooks; 03-23-2022, 09:37 PM.
                  Pushed around since 1966.


                  • #10
                    Hi Dave, I see that you had a question about the installation of an A wiring harness. Here is how I installed mine:
                    58367 The $75 Junkyard Carrera coupe restoration - ABCGT Forum

                    Page 66

                    They really can only be installed and removed one way. HTH.

                    Last edited by JTR70; 08-31-2022, 10:01 PM.
                    Justin Rio


                    • #11
                      Thanks Justin. Actually my original harness is in good shape, but I needed to run 10-12 additional wires from engine to dashboard, and I wanted it to look presentable. I put the wiring in ½" dia. heat shrink tubing and ran it through the bulkhead using the existing conduit. The problem I had to solve was how to route it through the tunnel. I could not find a path along the right side, they were full and the existing conduit sheath is pretty inflexible. So I crossed over under the shift rod and tied the bundle down to the metal work opposite the back up light switch. I watched the gear shift motion and it is well out of the way. It's not original but it works.
                      Retired software engineer
                      '59 Convertible D
                      '64 SC


                      • #12
                        The next chapter in the restoration is about to begin. The car is now a driver after 25 years, and I took it to West Coast Holiday, and it was a good way to get the kinks ironed out, or at least make them be acknowledged and put on the list to deal with. I am very happy with how it handles, other than minor things like swapping out the brake pads for something better and adjusting the Konis for a softer ride.

                        So I have been planning the exterior body work. Again, I want to keep the car on the road, but there will be some major work done and I won't be able to avoid pulling it off the road for that work. The problems I had fitting the hood is because the right fender is about ½" too low and the front clip is not fitted correctly. Today I installed a never-kinked A hood on the car and I could see the problems quite clearly. I think that hood will be my front end micrometer as the panels get installed. It has rust holes in the front, but those will get repaired too.

                        Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0836.jpg
Views:	78
Size:	87.0 KB
ID:	113339
                        Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0837.jpg
Views:	76
Size:	157.7 KB
ID:	113340
                        Both the front and rear of the car need to be addressed. The car was repaired probably 40 years ago using original Porsche panels, still with the green primer on the under side, never undercoated. Both a front and rear clip were installed in the 80's, and both of them were installed by overlaying the existing panels and using filler to overlay the seam. Then the car was hit in both front and rear again some time in the 90's, and repaired with filler. I think the car was raced. So the plan is to get down to bare metal in front and rear, remove the old clips and install new ones properly. Its a big project. I am ordering panels from Trevor's Hammer Works and I will learn as I go.

                        The panel list is:
                        1. rear body panel
                        2. nose panel
                        3. hood center frame member
                        4. front trunk wall
                        5. headlight buckets
                        6. right front fender
                        Last edited by Rimcanyon; 09-29-2022, 01:06 AM.
                        Retired software engineer
                        '59 Convertible D
                        '64 SC


                        • #13
                          Dave, that panel list is a long one! At least you know the car runs well before you start on that work, and that is I think a lot of work. No doubt you have looked closely at every thing Justin has been doing these past years and its not easy! Its surprising how many tools you need to get old panels off and you have to take into account some panels might need adjustment to fit. To centralise everything on the front too is not easy and that shows with the past repair and the gap errors to your 'A' hood you bought. To align even the headlight buckets has be thought of to get it right especially, as you are only replacing one wing (fender)
                          You must have managed well to fit the windscreen frame so I guess now you already have a good idea of what is involved but... I guess you have all the time to do it all as, it will be a long time!

                          I have just read what I have put down , and it looks like it might frighten some and that was not my intention! I know you have put you will learn as you go, but take into account as Justin has found, you can remove one panel to find underneath a further area that needs attention.
                          Why don't you start with just the right fender and see if you can fit that to suit the 'A' Hood? Providing the front nose is okay? Are the headlight buckets rusted out? Trying to fit that nose panel to an existing left side might be difficult?

                          Maybe the existing nose can be repaired without removal?

                          This is only my thoughts Dave I have not seen it of course !!!


                          • #14

                            Roy, thanks for replying to my post, I appreciate your interest in the project and your question is apt.

                            I can't point at one thing and say, this is why the front clip needs to be replaced. But getting rid of the overlay repair and replacing it with a proper repair by today’s standards is high on my list. However, here are the main problems:

                            The nose has a lot of filler.

                            The fit of the unkinked hood is not good along the front; it would be better if the clip was pushed forward 5-6mm or so.

                            Regarding the fender, the headlights are both at the right height and the shape of the fender is fine along the crown. I think it is the original fender. However, the area where the hood does not fit, the fender is too low. You can see it when the hood is up by looking at the gutter. Its as if 6-8mm in height was removed along the vertical wall of the gutter. Very strange. It looks like it was sliced to lower the fender to fit the clip, rather than correctly installing the clip to fit the fender.

                            Here is a picture. This is the same area as the picture above, looking out towards the fender. you can see how thin the vertical wall is along the gutter. The joint for the front clip is just to the right of the left edge of the photo:

                            Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0846.jpg
Views:	67
Size:	126.8 KB
ID:	113356

                            I could use one of Justin's tricks, and slice the vertical wall and weld in a strip to raise the fender to match the hood. The problem is a can of worms however, because the front clip needs to align. So I would still need to take apart the joint with the clip and fender. If I do that, I might have more success with new parts.

                            I'm glad you asked the question Roy. Maybe the thing to do is to try and repair the existing parts, and if that goes south, order the new front end.
                            Retired software engineer
                            '59 Convertible D
                            '64 SC


                            • #15
                              More observations about the old front end damage. To my eye, both front fenders are bowed out just ahead of the wheel well.

                              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_0850.jpg Views:	0 Size:	165.9 KB ID:	113359

                              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_0848.jpg Views:	0 Size:	114.2 KB ID:	113358

                              The right side fender was not properly aligned when the clip was installed. Look how the width of the gutter varies compared to the left side. There is a lot of lead there...

                              Click image for larger version

Name:	image_65789.jpg
Views:	62
Size:	178.5 KB
ID:	113361

                              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_0852.jpg Views:	0 Size:	146.3 KB ID:	113360

                              Despite all the above, the car looks ok from the front. The original hood has been massaged to fit (as described earlier in the thread), although the right fender is still lower than the hood.

                              Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_0838.jpg Views:	0 Size:	179.8 KB ID:	113364
                              Last edited by Rimcanyon; 10-01-2022, 05:55 PM.
                              Retired software engineer
                              '59 Convertible D
                              '64 SC